Sunday, 25 March 2018

Re: [7x12minilathe] Mini-Mill CNC, First Test of X-Axis.

 

back to the Consew CSM1000 they have a control panel which is cluchy. Reverse is  a two step process and there is no immediate stop.

But they are working great on my Clausing 8520 mill and my Delta 14" bandsaw.

Ralph

On Sun, Mar 25, 2018 at 7:18 PM, old_toolmaker@yahoo.com [7x12minilathe] <7x12minilathe@yahoogroups..com> wrote:
 

Thanks for the help, Chris!  I have a direction to move toward now.


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Re: [7x12minilathe] Mini-Mill CNC, First Test of X-Axis.

 

Thanks for the help, Chris!  I have a direction to move toward now.

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Re: [7x12minilathe] Mini-Mill CNC, First Test of X-Axis.

 



On Sun, Mar 25, 2018 at 12:11 PM, old_toolmaker@yahoo.com [7x12minilathe] <7x12minilathe@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 

Chris,


I found at least two types of hall effect sensors on EBay.  One is a proximity sensor and the other one looks flat with three prongs. Non appears to come with any installation documentation. 

Google will find a spec sheet.  Don't expect "install" instructions for a basic part like this.  It's a part, not a product.



Another question about steppers.
The one I saw on EBay comes with a compatible driver.  It would seem that one would still need some type of interface between the driver and operator to issue commands to the stepper.  Is that correct and if so what would one use? A computer with software designed for this?

Yes.  The driver is just that.   The basic user control would be just a knob you turn to control speed and a left/off/right switch.  You might do better with a computer (Arduino?) in the loop.    My goal is a full CNC capability while retaining the ability to do simply jobs manually.     But anything that can make pulses and a direction switch would work.     Put what if you want to mill a pocket?  I think you'd want the ability to program a "stop".   You can add 100 features to a controller or just go with a switch.   You could even build a mechanical controller -- get a 50 tooth gear and let a microswitch ride over the gear teeth.     A $3 Arduino might be the best solution.

To use the driver you must provide input to two pins (1) step and (2) direction.   Each pulse will step the motor some tiny faction.  to make it spin you supply hundreds of pulses per revolution.  The "dir" pin determine the direction of rotation.  

A first class installation would have limit swatches that debacle the pulses just before reaching the limit of travel.   But these motors are really not so powerful that would break the Mill if you crash into the end.

I'm waiting on thrust bearings to arrive from China then I will install the Y-Axis motor and then work on a better control system.   In the video I was using a lab bench signal generator to make the puses and a simple toggle switch for direction all held together is alligator clips.  The goal was proof of concept.

BTW I suggest NOT buying on eBay.  The prices there are to high and if you like the part it is hard to buy an identical unit months from now.   This is the best deal I have found.  The seller is very reliable.   That can ship from the US if you select "US" when you order.   Do that as shipping form other locations is very expensive.
Stepperonline is a Chinese company but they have invested in US and European warehouses so they can ship cheap and fast to the US and Europe,   Their drivers are all Leadshine with their own private label.








--

Chris Albertson
Redondo Beach, California

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Re: [7x12minilathe] Mini-Mill CNC, First Test of X-Axis.

 

Chris,


I found at least two types of hall effect sensors on EBay.  One is a proximity sensor and the other one looks flat with three prongs. Non appears to come with any installation documentation. 

Another question about steppers.
The one I saw on EBay comes with a compatible driver.  It would seem that one would still need some type of interface between the driver and operator to issue commands to the stepper.  Is that correct and if so what would one use? A computer with software designed for this?

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Re: [7x12minilathe] Mini-Mill CNC, First Test of X-Axis.

 

You can buy a very good and sensitive hall effect sensor on eBay for about 14 cents each.  The "49E" is linear over a wide range and reacts fast to  changing magnetic field and you can power it with a AA battery of cell phone charger.   You could do a test installation with just a 2" square of duct tape and  then when you find "Tis Spot" use epoxy.

This requires basic circuit design skills, some ability to write signal processing software and some test equipment, certainly a 'scope is needed.   I might try.  The first step I think might be to mount a 49E on wood or plastic stick and make a magnetic field probe for my scope then I could move the probe around and find where the signal is best

There is a good chance it might not work.  If the motor is inside a thick steel case the case might shield the magnetic field.  But it looks like an easy experiment and MIGHT even work on brushed motors.   The cost is so low it is worth trying and a magnetic probe might be good to have for other uses.

On Sun, Mar 25, 2018 at 5:16 AM, old_toolmaker@yahoo.com [7x12minilathe] <7x12minilathe@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 

OK, I think I understand most of what has been said so far. It must then be possible to use a hall effect sensor with to BLDC. Is that correct and can that be used on the mini lathe? Can that be done in a nice tidy fashion?




--

Chris Albertson
Redondo Beach, California

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Posted by: Chris Albertson <albertson.chris@gmail.com>
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Re: [7x12minilathe] Mini-Mill CNC, First Test of X-Axis.

 

Thanks for the details!

Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 25, 2018, at 12:56 PM, Jerry Durand jdurand@durandinterstellar.com [7x12minilathe] <7x12minilathe@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

 

They're mass produced to run sewing machines, that makes them cheaper.

The speed is controlled by setting max on the control panel and then using a foot pedal to ramp from BRAKE! to full speed.  Note the BRAKE! part, you might want to tweak things so you don't engage that with heavy mill parts spinning.

Reversing is done through the front panel, not hard but not the flick of a switch either.  It's assumed you're only doing that once during setup of the sewing machine.

On 03/25/2018 09:51 AM, Tim Iafolla iafollatim@yahoo.com [7x12minilathe] wrote:
I've been looking at these Consew motors but they seemed too good to be true for the price. Does that $99 include the necessary electronics, including a speed ramp control and reverse switch?  If so that's sort of amazing.

Thanks!


--   Jerry Durand, Durand Interstellar, Inc.  www.DurandInterstellar.com  tel: +1 408 356-3886  @DurandInterstel

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Re: [7x12minilathe] Mini-Mill CNC, First Test of X-Axis.

 

Yea - vids of my set up here:
http://www.ajawamnet.com/ajawam3/swarf/maxnc.html
on my grinder:
http://www.ajawamnet.com/ajawam3/swarf/cutter_grinder.html

Note these are hot chassis so trying to control speed via your CNC
controller can be a bit tricky, since you'll need to galvanically isolate.

We've talked about this [ad nauseam some may say] before on this and the
Taig forum, and I recently found out that other, actual spindle BLDC
from other vendors have similar issues of hot chassis. My day job was
looking at getting a packaged CNC from some industrial CNC shop that
retrofitted Rong-Fu style machines. During a conference call the sales
engineer mentioned the trouble they went thru to allow their CNC
controller access to varying the spindle speed.

Since I don't have a tool changer, I really didn't feel I needed to have
Mach 3/4 change the speeds for me.

Note that the newer CSM Consews are a bit different than the CS version
I have. They went from using an LDR and LED to using a hall effect pedal
control, as well as simplified it with a smaller uC based on the ST
Microdevices BLDC reference design. this was due to the core customer
base (actual sewing machine applications) not digging the acceleration
profile; esp the low end control.

I've been using mince for about 4 years now, on jobs lasting many hours
and have no issues so far.

On 3/25/2018 12:51 PM, Tim Iafolla iafollatim@yahoo.com [7x12minilathe]
wrote:
> I've been looking at these Consew motors but they seemed too good to be true for the price. Does that $99 include the necessary electronics, including a speed ramp control and reverse switch? If so that's sort of amazing.
>
> Thanks!
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>> On Mar 25, 2018, at 11:54 AM, Ralph Hulslander rhulslander@gmail.com [7x12minilathe] <7x12minilathe@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>>
>> I put a 3/4 hp Consew BLDC motor on my vertical mill.
>>
>> I also put one on my Bandsaw.
>>
>> I have another eventtually for my lathe.
>>
>> These are from Ebay at $99.00 I might buy some more just to have at hand.
>>
>> I did the mill and bandsaw two years ago and they both work great, I have run the mill and bandsaw at 500 rpm and less on the motor and still got good torque.
>>
>>
>>> On Sun, Mar 25, 2018 at 8:16 AM, old_toolmaker@yahoo.com [7x12minilathe] <7x12minilathe@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> OK, I think I understand most of what has been said so far. It must then be possible to use a hall effect sensor with to BLDC. Is that correct and can that be used on the mini lathe? Can that be done in a nice tidy fashion?
>>>
>>

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Re: [7x12minilathe] Mini-Mill CNC, First Test of X-Axis.

 

They're mass produced to run sewing machines, that makes them cheaper.

The speed is controlled by setting max on the control panel and then using a foot pedal to ramp from BRAKE! to full speed.  Note the BRAKE! part, you might want to tweak things so you don't engage that with heavy mill parts spinning.

Reversing is done through the front panel, not hard but not the flick of a switch either.  It's assumed you're only doing that once during setup of the sewing machine.

On 03/25/2018 09:51 AM, Tim Iafolla iafollatim@yahoo.com [7x12minilathe] wrote:
I've been looking at these Consew motors but they seemed too good to be true for the price. Does that $99 include the necessary electronics, including a speed ramp control and reverse switch?  If so that's sort of amazing.

Thanks!


--   Jerry Durand, Durand Interstellar, Inc.  www.DurandInterstellar.com  tel: +1 408 356-3886  @DurandInterstel

__._,_.___
Posted by: Jerry Durand <jdurand@durandinterstellar.com>
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.

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Re: [7x12minilathe] Mini-Mill CNC, First Test of X-Axis.

 

I've been looking at these Consew motors but they seemed too good to be true for the price. Does that $99 include the necessary electronics, including a speed ramp control and reverse switch?  If so that's sort of amazing.


Thanks!

Sent from my iPhone

On Mar 25, 2018, at 11:54 AM, Ralph Hulslander rhulslander@gmail.com [7x12minilathe] <7x12minilathe@yahoogroups.com> wrote:

 

I put a 3/4 hp Consew BLDC motor on my vertical mill.

I also put one on my Bandsaw.

I have another eventtually for my lathe.

These are from Ebay at $99.00 I might buy some more just to have at hand.

I did the mill and bandsaw two years ago and they both work great, I have run the mill and bandsaw at 500 rpm and less on the motor and still got good torque.


On Sun, Mar 25, 2018 at 8:16 AM, old_toolmaker@yahoo.com [7x12minilathe] <7x12minilathe@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 

OK, I think I understand most of what has been said so far. It must then be possible to use a hall effect sensor with to BLDC. Is that correct and can that be used on the mini lathe? Can that be done in a nice tidy fashion?


__._,_.___
Posted by: Tim Iafolla <iafollatim@yahoo.com>
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.

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Posted by at No comments:

Re: [7x12minilathe] Mini-Mill CNC, First Test of X-Axis.

 

I put a 3/4 hp Consew BLDC motor on my vertical mill.

I also put one on my Bandsaw.

I have another eventtually for my lathe.

These are from Ebay at $99.00 I might buy some more just to have at hand.

I did the mill and bandsaw two years ago and they both work great, I have run the mill and bandsaw at 500 rpm and less on the motor and still got good torque.


On Sun, Mar 25, 2018 at 8:16 AM, old_toolmaker@yahoo.com [7x12minilathe] <7x12minilathe@yahoogroups.com> wrote:
 

OK, I think I understand most of what has been said so far. It must then be possible to use a hall effect sensor with to BLDC. Is that correct and can that be used on the mini lathe? Can that be done in a nice tidy fashion?


__._,_.___
Posted by: Ralph Hulslander <rhulslander@gmail.com>
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.

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Posted by at No comments:

Re: [7x12minilathe] Mini-Mill CNC, First Test of X-Axis.

 

OK, I think I understand most of what has been said so far. It must then be possible to use a hall effect sensor with to BLDC. Is that correct and can that be used on the mini lathe? Can that be done in a nice tidy fashion?

__._,_.___
Posted by: old_toolmaker@yahoo.com
Reply via web post • Reply to sender • Reply to group • Start a New Topic • Messages in this topic (54)
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.

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