Metalwork - Lathe and Mill topics: August 2012

Thursday, 23 August 2012

[southbendlathe] Trying a test post

The 999 error has gotten the better of me...

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Monday, 13 August 2012

[atlas_craftsman] Re: My rust removal test

I have several commercial cabinets that I use for various things. The trick is to use the appropriate media in the blaster --machine parts, etc. use walnut shells. You'd be hard pressed to find a method that would do less damage, short of a toothbrush and water.

I also use electrolysis quite often --each process to it's appropriate job, is my way of looking at things.

--- In atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com, Charles Gallo <Charlie@...> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> On Aug 13, 2012, at 8:43 AM, Guenther Paul <paulguenter@...> wrote:
>
> > JT
> > You are absolutely correct sand has no place on any machine.
>
> I'd more agree with JT that it is limited, vs no place. Ran across some rusty legs where sandblasting would work, ditto the bottom of the stand on my current machine. But any place that is supposed to be a machined surface? Shudder
> >
>

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Re: [atlas_craftsman] Re: My rust removal test

Nice writeup Scott - Short and to the point.

For two years, I had an old computer power supply that was used in
everything from 5 gallon buckets to a 300 gallon horse watering trough. I
used that to strip the paint, grease and rust off numerous tools including
a Sheldon horizontal mill and its 30" x 30" X34" plate steel base. After
using it a year, I realized I was only using the 5 volt leads.

For me, practice was to do the following in (or next to) my old garage
which is quite airy:

1. Initial cleaning with spray on oven cleaner (outside, gloves, working to
the side with the wind blowing over the part). Works great for the initial
degreasing (heavy deposits and thick paint).
2. Rinse and disassemble, hanging all parts into bucket with sacraficial
sheet metal (from old computer boxes) around the parts
3. TUrning on power supply and leaving it for a week. (Ocassionally would
check and lightly scrub loosend paint away)
4. Rinse all in clear water scrubbing with a SS wire brush and dry
thoroughly. Put in a sunny place if possible to heat up parts.
5. Lightly wire brush any surface rust then wipe with a rag with paint
thinner
6. Rattle can prime with a good metal (bare/rusty metal) primer

Any surfaces that were to remain unpainted, I wired brushed, wiped then
waxed them with floor wax after painting.

I did this with several old woodworking tools and it was very nice to see
the original surface grinding on the work surfaces stand right out.

I did the prep and forget it method because I have young kids and lots of
house projects. If I did not get back to it for a 2 or more weeks, I did
not worry about it since the current kept the part rust free.

Brian

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Re: [atlas_craftsman] Re: My rust removal test

On Aug 13, 2012, at 8:43 AM, Guenther Paul <paulguenter@att.net> wrote:

> JT
> You are absolutely correct sand has no place on any machine.

I'd more agree with JT that it is limited, vs no place. Ran across some rusty legs where sandblasting would work, ditto the bottom of the stand on my current machine. But any place that is supposed to be a machined surface? Shudder
>

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Re: [atlas_craftsman] Re: My rust removal test

JT
You are absolutely correct sand has no place on any machine. Its done by sellers
to make them look better
GP

________________________________
From: "jerdal@sbcglobal.net" <jerdal@sbcglobal.net>
To: atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com
Sent: Mon, August 13, 2012 8:34:54 AM
Subject: Re: [atlas_craftsman] Re: My rust removal test

Sandblasting has little place in serious machine re-building, so you may not
be missing much.

Think of all those ebay machines with the nice clean sandblasted ways,
gears, and leadscrews............. not to mention the angle grinder flaking
of the ways.....

JT

----- Original Message -----
From: "Clive" <cliveadams23@aol.com>
To: <atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, August 13, 2012 5:14 AM
Subject: [atlas_craftsman] Re: My rust removal test

> Sand/bead blasting would be great but it's just a dream for me. I just
> don't have the space for it, so electrolysis is a good alternative.
>
> I use a big plastic bucket with a double steel hoop made of 1/2" square
> bar all round the inside. When it gets covered in rust I just whiz around
> it with the angle grinder until I see bright metal then I'm good to go!
>
> I stripped a Myford MF32 lathe back to bare metal a couple of years ago
> and treated all the parts with electrolysis - came up really good.
>
> Clive

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

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[atlas_craftsman] Re: My rust removal test

That's true. But I would like to think I have enough mechanical sympathy to use the appropriate method.

Sandblasting facilities would be VERY useful in one of my other hobbies though - motorcycle restoration!

Clive

--- In atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com, <jerdal@...> wrote:
>
> Sandblasting has little place in serious machine re-building, so you may not
> be missing much.
>
> Think of all those ebay machines with the nice clean sandblasted ways,
> gears, and leadscrews............. not to mention the angle grinder flaking
> of the ways.....
>
> JT
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Clive" <cliveadams23@...>
> To: <atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com>
> Sent: Monday, August 13, 2012 5:14 AM
> Subject: [atlas_craftsman] Re: My rust removal test
>
>
> > Sand/bead blasting would be great but it's just a dream for me. I just
> > don't have the space for it, so electrolysis is a good alternative.
> >
> > I use a big plastic bucket with a double steel hoop made of 1/2" square
> > bar all round the inside. When it gets covered in rust I just whiz around
> > it with the angle grinder until I see bright metal then I'm good to go!
> >
> > I stripped a Myford MF32 lathe back to bare metal a couple of years ago
> > and treated all the parts with electrolysis - came up really good.
> >
> > Clive
>

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Re: [atlas_craftsman] Re: My rust removal test

Sandblasting has little place in serious machine re-building, so you may not
be missing much.

Think of all those ebay machines with the nice clean sandblasted ways,
gears, and leadscrews............. not to mention the angle grinder flaking
of the ways.....

JT

----- Original Message -----
From: "Clive" <cliveadams23@aol.com>
To: <atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com>
Sent: Monday, August 13, 2012 5:14 AM
Subject: [atlas_craftsman] Re: My rust removal test

> Sand/bead blasting would be great but it's just a dream for me. I just
> don't have the space for it, so electrolysis is a good alternative.
>
> I use a big plastic bucket with a double steel hoop made of 1/2" square
> bar all round the inside. When it gets covered in rust I just whiz around
> it with the angle grinder until I see bright metal then I'm good to go!
>
> I stripped a Myford MF32 lathe back to bare metal a couple of years ago
> and treated all the parts with electrolysis - came up really good.
>
> Clive

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[atlas_craftsman] Re: My rust removal test

Sand/bead blasting would be great but it's just a dream for me. I just don't have the space for it, so electrolysis is a good alternative.

I use a big plastic bucket with a double steel hoop made of 1/2" square bar all round the inside. When it gets covered in rust I just whiz around it with the angle grinder until I see bright metal then I'm good to go!

I stripped a Myford MF32 lathe back to bare metal a couple of years ago and treated all the parts with electrolysis - came up really good.

Clive

--- In atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com, Scott Henion <shenion@...> wrote:
>
> On 8/13/2012 3:43 AM, Clive wrote:
> > Well done on the electrolysis. I've been using it for quite a few years with brilliant results - IIRC I saw the instructions on Instructables.
>
> Been on my 2do list for a long time. Since I got a sand blast cabinet
> and glass bead, have not had a real need for it.
>
> The supply goes from 0-30V up to 15 amps or more. So I should be able to
> do something fairly big.
>
> Would have been nice for my old 109 lathe. The old 4-jaw chuck was a bit
> rusty. A few minutes bead blasting and looked like new. Then spent a
> long time getting the beads out of the threads :(
>
> Bead blasting is great as it does not remove material (or very little.)
> Great on aluminum as it shatters the brittle oxide layer then bounces
> off the bare metal.
>
> >
> > I use an ATX computer power supply to power mine. If you short the green wire in the motherboard plug to any black wire with a paperclip, the power supply thinks it's connected to a motherboard and will happily deliver 5 and 12 volts from the Molex hard disk connectors at pretty high amperages.
> >
> > I've heard dire warnings against this but have never had any problems over a period of years . . .
>
> The issue is the power supply may shut down.
>
> I built a router in a 1U case. An old PIII. It had no hard disk, just a
> compact flash drive. So it did not use much +5V or +12V. It had a nasty
> habit of shutting down. I had to add a dummy load to the +5V, then it
> was better. Still did it once in a while. Ended up sticking and old CD
> drive as another dummy load ;) Supply died and could not find a
> replacement under 200W so had to go to another case (old supply had near
> 0 airflow).
>
> What happens is the several voltages may not be independently regulated,
> just different windings of the core. If one supply is loaded and the
> other is not; the unloaded supply may reach over-voltage and the supply
> will shut down.
>
> Or the opposite will happen. The unloaded supply is the one that is
> regulated and the used one may not provide much power.
>
> Some supplies may have a crowbar to protect from over-voltage. That
> could be tripped also (and cheap supplies may just die when this happens.)
>
> I had an old AT supply that I cut the DC power leads and connected them
> to a barrier strip. Made a nice bench supply. I used to call it my "Tube
> supply" as it glowed like an old tube amp. That's because I had an auto
> tail light inside on the +5V to keep the supply stable giving a dim
> orange glow ;)
>
> --
>
> ------------------------------------
> Scott G. Henion
> Craftsman 12x36 lathe:
> http://shdesigns.org/Craftsman12x36
> ------------------------------------
>

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Re: [atlas_craftsman] Re: My rust removal test

On 8/13/2012 3:43 AM, Clive wrote:
> Well done on the electrolysis. I've been using it for quite a few years with brilliant results - IIRC I saw the instructions on Instructables.

Been on my 2do list for a long time. Since I got a sand blast cabinet
and glass bead, have not had a real need for it.

The supply goes from 0-30V up to 15 amps or more. So I should be able to
do something fairly big.

Would have been nice for my old 109 lathe. The old 4-jaw chuck was a bit
rusty. A few minutes bead blasting and looked like new. Then spent a
long time getting the beads out of the threads :(

Bead blasting is great as it does not remove material (or very little.)
Great on aluminum as it shatters the brittle oxide layer then bounces
off the bare metal.

>
> I use an ATX computer power supply to power mine. If you short the green wire in the motherboard plug to any black wire with a paperclip, the power supply thinks it's connected to a motherboard and will happily deliver 5 and 12 volts from the Molex hard disk connectors at pretty high amperages.
>
> I've heard dire warnings against this but have never had any problems over a period of years . . .

The issue is the power supply may shut down.

I built a router in a 1U case. An old PIII. It had no hard disk, just a
compact flash drive. So it did not use much +5V or +12V. It had a nasty
habit of shutting down. I had to add a dummy load to the +5V, then it
was better. Still did it once in a while. Ended up sticking and old CD
drive as another dummy load ;) Supply died and could not find a
replacement under 200W so had to go to another case (old supply had near
0 airflow).

What happens is the several voltages may not be independently regulated,
just different windings of the core. If one supply is loaded and the
other is not; the unloaded supply may reach over-voltage and the supply
will shut down.

Or the opposite will happen. The unloaded supply is the one that is
regulated and the used one may not provide much power.

Some supplies may have a crowbar to protect from over-voltage. That
could be tripped also (and cheap supplies may just die when this happens.)

I had an old AT supply that I cut the DC power leads and connected them
to a barrier strip. Made a nice bench supply. I used to call it my "Tube
supply" as it glowed like an old tube amp. That's because I had an auto
tail light inside on the +5V to keep the supply stable giving a dim
orange glow ;)

--

------------------------------------
Scott G. Henion
Craftsman 12x36 lathe:
http://shdesigns.org/Craftsman12x36
------------------------------------

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[atlas_craftsman] Re: My rust removal test

Well done on the electrolysis. I've been using it for quite a few years with brilliant results - IIRC I saw the instructions on Instructables.

I use an ATX computer power supply to power mine. If you short the green wire in the motherboard plug to any black wire with a paperclip, the power supply thinks it's connected to a motherboard and will happily deliver 5 and 12 volts from the Molex hard disk connectors at pretty high amperages.

I've heard dire warnings against this but have never had any problems over a period of years . . .

Thanks again for the write-up.

Clive

--- In atlas_craftsman@yahoogroups.com, Scott Henion <shenion@...> wrote:
>
> I had a pair of pliers fall out of a crappy riding mower I was
> scrapping. All rusted, and barely even moved.
>
> Put it aside until I could try electrolysis. Finally found some washing
> soda. Had the impression it was a small box, not a cereal-box size, so
> may have missed it. Was in supermarket where bleach and spot treaters were.
>
> 5-minute write up here:
> http://shdesigns.org/Welding/electro.shtml
>
> Worked well, I had about 5-7 amps at 17 Volts or so. Took less than an
> hour.
>
>
> --
>
> ------------------------------------
> Scott G. Henion
> Craftsman 12x36 lathe:
> http://shdesigns.org/Craftsman12x36
> ------------------------------------
>

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Saturday, 11 August 2012

[atlas_craftsman] My rust removal test

I had a pair of pliers fall out of a crappy riding mower I was
scrapping. All rusted, and barely even moved.

Put it aside until I could try electrolysis. Finally found some washing
soda. Had the impression it was a small box, not a cereal-box size, so
may have missed it. Was in supermarket where bleach and spot treaters were.

5-minute write up here:
http://shdesigns.org/Welding/electro.shtml

Worked well, I had about 5-7 amps at 17 Volts or so. Took less than an
hour.

--

------------------------------------
Scott G. Henion
Craftsman 12x36 lathe:
http://shdesigns.org/Craftsman12x36
------------------------------------

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Thursday, 2 August 2012

Re: [southbendlathe] Well, I found the "test piece" of 303 I thought I'd lost...

I'd look for Viking brand. I have used them a few times. In my limited use, they are very good. I think made in Minnesota.
Tom

From: bogiestl <bogie@posterprep.com>
To: southbendlathe@yahoogroups.com
Date: 08/01/2012 08:49 PM
Subject: [southbendlathe] Well, I found the "test piece" of 303 I thought I'd lost...
Sent by: southbendlathe@yahoogroups.com

Oh, and thanks for all the help... I'm slowly figuring my way around the controls, and figuring workarounds to how I was used to doing things...

Of course, I'm off to the tooling store tomorrow, because I just basically welded a Chinese letter-size twist drill into a piece of 303 that was sitting amongst the very similar looking chunks of stressproof... Thought things felt odd, looked, and it was glowing... 1400 rpm, and I'd dipped it in straight trim sol before I shoved the chuck's taper in the tailstock... Anyone have any recommendations for twist drills, preferably stub, for 303? That was going to be a future project, but what the heck...

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